In July 1994 Dr. Kim Duncan visited Winnipeg and met with Youngson, Giddins and several of the perfusionists. He recalled that they spoke to him of the tensions within the program. Following those discussions, he met with Dr. Helmut Unruh, the acting section head of cardiovascular and thoracic surgery. Duncan testified that:

My comments to Helmut Unruh were, was there any way, or was it possible for him to observe, or possible for somebody else to observe or participate in order to see if there were, in fact, problems. I didn't-

Q. You asked Helmut if it was possible-

A. My comment to him was, if you have four people, who I think are quite credible people, saying there are some difficulties in the operating room, then there is probably at least reason for somebody to look into it. (Evidence, page 30,595)

Unruh testified that he could not recall the details of this conversation. Duncan also spoke with Odim. The two men agreed that the program should be serviced by a small number of anaesthetists. However, Odim left Duncan with the impression that he felt the program was running well.